Never Seen It Podcast

Never Seen It Podcast — Episode 99 Project Hail Mary (2026)

Episode Summary

Can a hard science fiction movie about astrophysics, alien biology, and saving humanity also become one of the most emotional buddy movies of the year? We discuss Project Hail Mary, Ryan Gosling’s performance as Ryland Grace, Rocky’s unforgettable introduction, the film’s visual style, its emotional core, and whether the adaptation successfully captures Andy Weir’s bestselling novel. We also debate whether showing Rocky in the trailers was actually a spoiler, what the movie leaves out from the book, and why this first-contact story works so well.

Episode Notes

We’re talking about Project Hail Mary, the science fiction adventure based on Andy Weir’s bestselling novel, and we’re joined by sci-fi writer and VFX compositor Jordan Spaulding for a deep discussion about the movie, the book, and everything that makes this adaptation work.

At its heart, Project Hail Mary follows Ryland Grace, a science teacher who wakes up alone aboard a spaceship light-years from Earth with no memory of how he got there. As his memories return, Grace discovers that humanity is facing an extinction-level threat and that he has been sent on an impossible mission to figure out how to save the planet. But the story becomes something much more than a survival story when Grace encounters Rocky, an alien astronaut facing the same cosmic crisis.

We start by discussing what it’s like to experience Project Hail Mary without having read the book. Lisa came into the movie with very different expectations after seeing the marketing, expecting something faster-paced before discovering that the movie takes its time establishing its characters and mystery. That slower opening ultimately pays off with an unexpectedly emotional science fiction story.

For those of us who read Andy Weir’s novel, we also dig into one of the biggest challenges facing any book-to-film adaptation: how much of the science and technical detail can actually make it onto the screen? The book spends considerably more time walking readers through the mathematics, scientific problem-solving, alien biology, language, and technology behind Grace’s mission. We discuss whether the movie successfully preserves the spirit of that material even when it has to compress or eliminate the details.

That leads into one of the biggest debates of the episode: is the movie actually better than the book in some ways? Rather than simply declaring that one version is superior, we discuss how novels and movies provide fundamentally different storytelling tools. The book can live inside Grace’s thoughts and explain complex scientific processes, while the movie can deliver spectacle, production design, visual effects, sound, and performances in ways the novel simply cannot.

We also tackle the marketing controversy surrounding Rocky. Was showing the alien in the trailers a major spoiler? Or was Rocky so central to the story’s premise that audiences needed to know what kind of movie they were buying a ticket to see? We argue that revealing Rocky may actually have been the right decision because the first-contact relationship between Rocky and Grace is the emotional and narrative heart of Project Hail Mary.

And speaking of Rocky, we spend plenty of time discussing why non-human characters like Rocky, Grogu, Groot, Rocket Raccoon, and other beloved sci-fi and fantasy mascots connect with audiences so strongly. We explore innocence, vulnerability, empathy, companionship, and the way these characters can reflect humanity back at us from an outsider’s perspective.

One of the biggest strengths of Project Hail Mary is the relationship between Rocky and Ryland Grace. Beneath all the astrophysics and alien science, we argue that this is ultimately a buddy movie about two beings from completely different worlds who discover that they don’t have to face an impossible situation alone. The film’s emotional power depends on that friendship working, and we discuss why it works so well.

We also talk about the movie’s exploration of loneliness. Grace begins the story completely isolated, surrounded by the bodies of his dead crewmates and slowly recovering memories of the mission. Meeting Rocky changes everything. Their relationship introduces humor, warmth, and companionship into a story that could otherwise have been an extremely bleak survival narrative.

The adaptation’s visual storytelling gets plenty of attention, too. We discuss the design of the Hail Mary, Rocky’s ship, the alien environments, Rocky’s unusual perception of the world, and the film’s colorful approach to science fiction cinematography. We also examine how the movie uses sound and music as part of Rocky’s world and technology, particularly the way sound frequencies become an important part of the alien communication and environment.

Another major topic is the film’s emotional impact. Despite all of the hard science fiction concepts, we found ourselves talking just as much about grief, isolation, friendship, sacrifice, and the importance of cooperation. The story’s optimism stands out because Project Hail Mary presents humanity’s survival as something that requires people to work together rather than simply relying on one heroic individual.

We also compare the movie with the book and discuss what we would have changed. One major criticism is that the film could have spent more time developing Grace’s relationships with his fellow astronauts before their deaths. The book gives those relationships more room to breathe, which makes Grace’s grief and memories hit harder.

We also wish the movie had given Sandra Hüller’s character more to do. Her role is considerably more substantial in the book, and we discuss why giving Hüller additional screen time could have strengthened the story even further.

Finally, we talk about Ryan Gosling, the directing team of Phil Lord and Christopher Miller, the movie’s balance of comedy and drama, and why Project Hail Mary succeeds as both accessible blockbuster entertainment and hard science fiction. Adrian ultimately gives the movie 4.5 out of 5 stars, while the conversation leaves us wondering whether we’d want to see more of Grace and Rocky’s lives after the events of the movie.

If you’ve seen Project Hail Mary, we want to know: Did you read Andy Weir’s book first, and do you think the movie lived up to it?

Episode Transcription

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Welcome to the Never Seen It Podcast, The only podcast called Never Seen It That's worth listening to.

With us tonight, Mr. Daily Dares, a.k.

Filipino Grigio, aka.

Alex Caligo, is here with us tonight.

And then there's Miss Lisa Counterman,

that red feather girl on Instagram.

Lisa Ret return special guest host.

Welcome back, Lisa.

Glad to have you on the show tonight.

And a special guest tonight.

Well, by way before we get into that, let me talk about myself for a second really quick.

I'm Boots Too Big, aK.

Adrian D. Tonight we have a special guest, good friend of mine

known him for over 10 years now at this point.

Jordan Spalding, who was a scii writer and VFX

compositor, currently based in Davis, California, where he lives with his partner,

his two parents, and his dog,

Fig, which is a great name for a dog.

And I'm glad I remember that.

You.

Welcome to the show, Jordan.

There she has passed out over there.

Digging a nap.

Sleep.

Sleeping.

Jordan and I have known each other for over 10 years.

Like I said, we've worked on many up writing projects, filmmaking projects together.

Jordan loves the movies and he's a storyteller through and through

and we both read and watched Project Hail Mary and we thought, hey, this

is going to be the perfect episode episode to discuss that movie with.

So thank you, Jordan, again for joining us tonight.

And I know that you and I have both read this book.

Lisa, have you read the book?

Did you read Project Hail Mary?

I did not.

I did not.

No?

I was a late comer to watching it.

Everybody was talking about the movie and I was like, I don't know what that is.

And I actually just watched it like two weeks ago.

Well, let me ask you this.

What was your perception of the movie, Have you not read the book?

Like, what did you think after watching like the trailer and other marketing material?

So the trailer, I felt like I expected

it to go more quickly at the beginning.

I was sort of, I thought it was like this best pace thing.

It kind of reminded me of like E.T. a little bit

And that's sort of what I expected.

Then the beginning, I was like,

it's a little bit more slow than I thought it wasn't exactly what

I expected at the beginning, and then I won't spoil it till

we get to it, but then I was in tears.

And I was like

How am I emotional about this?

I don't get it

But it got me about about a third of the way through that

I got interested and could not stop watching it

I got teary eyed too

And by the way, to talk about what the movie is about, for those of you that don't

know, since I forgot to do it at the top of the show.

Project Hale Mary is a science fiction film

about a science teacher, Rylan Grace, who wakes up on a spaceship light

years from home with no recollection of who he is or how he got there.

As his memory returns, he begins to uncover his mission,

solve the riddle of the mysterious substance, causing the sun to die out.

He must call on a scientific knowledge and unorthodox ideas

to save everything on earth from extinction

but an unexpected friendship

means that he

may not have to do it alone

I'm Grace.

I'm gonna call you Rocky.

So I met an alien.

He's a genius engineer.

And if I can't understand what he's saying, he puts on a little puppet show from me and my tiny brain, and you know what?

I don't mind it

And it stars, of course, Ryan Gosling, James

Ortiz, Sandra Holler, who's fantastic, directed

by Phil Lord and Chris Miller, who directed everything from the Lego movie to 21 Jump Street.

All great movies.

Street.

But yeah, that's Project H Mary came out this year.

Alex

did you read the book, by the way?

I don't think I ever asked you that.

No, I've never read the book.

What was your perception of it before having watched it?

Well, so I

I remember probably being one

of the biggest like talked about films at San Diego Comic-Con

last year, 2025.

They had the panel there.

In Hall H, Ryan Gosling was in attendance.

And it seemed to be really

like take the everybody's attention.

Like other than like Peacemaker

which was another big one that was at last year's San Diego Comic-Con.

Alex, was Rocky there for the panel?

You know, I honestly, I don't know..

I think they kind of tried to keep that like a little bit of a secret.

Uh-huh.

this year, this year at

Sand Comic Conon, there were a lot of like really cool,

like rocky related merchandise.

I picked up an enamel pin from one of my favorite

enamel pin makers.

And then I recently found out that they had Rocky

action figures and I was like, wait a minute.

Why?

How did I miss that?

I would have I would have loved to own one

of those and so Fully articulated..

Like a little remote control, like a robot.

You can like run around.

And a hamster ball.

Yeah, a ham, yeah.

In the little like

I wonder if it did, like at least the packaging.

That would have been cool, like, cool packaging, it in.

You never take it out of the package.

I'm already that way anyways.

Yeah.

I don't take any white toys out of a package.

Unless it's a blind box.

Yeah.

I was going to say, so Jordan, as someone who else has

read the book as well, I mean, I know it's almost unfair to compare a

book in a movie, but I feel like they got really close and this

with this scenario with like the movie is in some ways even better than the book.

Dare I say, what do you think?

Really?

No, I mean, like

you know, as like a purist, I'm always like, listen, the book was better.

The book is always better.

I mean, like, it's hard science fiction.

So all my favorite parts are when he's like going through the math..

In the book, it's very much it like brings you along with the process.

It's very like, even like understandable, like high school math,

like here's how we figure out what these elements are, here's how we figure out what speed we're going at.

And I love all that.

I thought that was kind of like the heart of the movie.

It's about

Grace like figuring out how

to solve the problems, using like technology from our time.

And that really like made it like heightened the experience of it.

And so like, I understand for the movie, they did not want to go into all of that and they couldn't.

And I thought they got kind of like the best points of it

And like Tisa's point, like the it was it was in

some ways like front loaded because that's a lot of where the emotional buildup is, a lot of the characters, a lot of the stakes.

So like makes sense.

And I was sort of, it was like, oh, so

much of the beginning of act two is missing from the film because we

have to just like, okay, now the action's happening, now this part's happening.

So like, yeah, I love the movie

and obviously no one wants to watch like the six hour version, that's completely true to the book.

They're both good, but they're like very different properties, you know?

They compressed a lot of that, like you said, the first or the yeah, the second act.

They had to kind of really compress a lot of the

math stuff and the science stuff, which And I saw online, people had questions

They were like, how did this happen?

How did they accomplish this?

And like all of those things, they're not like plot holes.

They were answered in the book, but they have to kind of like keep things moving in the.

Well, you know, it's funny because in the book, he had like that magic computer

that had like every software known to man.

I thought that was interesting.

He had like that sort of duet X

computer that can do anything in that computer that can program, it can do all kinds.

They do on the movie, though.

No, they do kind of allude to it, though, because I remember when

they were giving gifts to each other or when, uh, they

find the solution to the Estrophage.

they're giving, well, Grace is giving a gift to

Rocky and it's like a laptop with all all what he called all human knowledge.

Oh, that's true.

That's true.

I I forgot about that.

And that played such a large role in the book, too.

Right?

It was like they didn't, they had lots of technology, but they're very analog.

Like they had never developed something like a thinking machine

And so the idea of a laptop was like a huge, like cultural technological exchange for their species.

That's a good point.

And by the way, HLP's in the chat with us tonight.

Honor.nold's in the chat.

Arnold couldn't be here.

He's in where is he, Santa Barbara?

He's a He's vacationing on the beach of Santa Barbara watching whales.

Nice.

Evening clam chowder andi.

Yeah.

Sea urchin.

Yeah.

Oh, not.

No special hipsh tonight.

He's hip shaking on the beach.

That's what he's doing.

So I want to talk about, and

I know we talk about this a lot with almost a lot of the movies we discussed.

The marketing, as far as this one goes, where do we stand on the discourse

about, is it a spoiler that they had Rocky in the trailer?

Lisa, I want to start with you as someone who hadn hasn't read the book.

Did you think that was a spoiler in your mind?

What do you think about that?

No, and I'm glad that they did a couple of

reasons, because since it was a little slow in the beginning,

I thought, I'm glad that I knew that that was coming.

Because I was like, had they, and I'm, I'm a math teacher.

So

had they put all math in the be beginning, like it sounds like

they had in the book, I might have stayed interested,

but I have the feeling that it, you know, 90% of everybody else

would have turned it off and been like, I'm not in school.

I'm this is not what I want.

But I think knowing that that creature was coming, it intrigued me.

Like

I'm, I'll have to say, when I first saw it on the trailer, I am very arachnophobic.

And I was like, that looks like a giant spider.

But part of me was like, but clearly they're not just going to put a giant spider in this movie.

It's it's, you know, it's science fiction.

It's not just going to be a spider.

So that intrigued me to keep watching, to meet what this creature was.

And I was like, how are they going to pull this off without it being cheesy?

And

there was so much hubbub about the movie.

I'm like, clearly it's good.

So it's not going to be cheesy, some spiderider in a ball.

So I'm glad that they put it in there because that made me stay

and find out like, what is that and what relationship do they have?

How can this creature, like, how are they communicating?

So it made me stay to actually watch it.

And to give you a little context, like, we meet Rocky like

a 100 pages into the, in the book, give or take, and the book is like 400 plus pages long.

Oh, okay..

I didn't see it as a was a big suppor.

Yeah.

I mean, when I read it, it was it was, I did not see it coming.

I did not expect it.

I was not spoiled beforehand, at least for the book version

Yeah.

Huh.

Interesting.

What about you, Alex?

Did you watch the trailer?

Or did you go on blind?

I watched the trailer after

all the talk at Comic-Con last year.

Oh, okay..

I thought it was really, I liked the trailer.

I didn't, I wasn't super sold on it

but I think that as it got

closer and closer to the actual premiere,

it really, it kind of started ramping up, especially when they started showing Rocky.

And I think that was a smart move because, obviously, like it didn't spoil it.

And two

it's a good marketing tool.

Rocky's a great, but he's like Grogu.

He's like Grogu.

You know what I mean?

Like, here's the thing.

Like, if the Mandalorian and had

Grogu at the very beginning, or like in all the trailers

of the very first season, I think even more people would

have like showed up for the premierre instead of like the whole word

of mouth thing, they're like, oh, you gotta watch it, you know?

I think that's the same thing thing that happened with,

you know, Project Hail Mary, you have this like

cuty, like for some people some people

a very kind of adorable alien creature,

especially the way that they were like, in that one scene where they're emulating each other's movements, you know?

Yep.

That's a very, very like, okay, hook me.

Because he's just like this like alien who's just kind of like,

a little bit naive.

Thumbs up, you know?

Yeah, I'm.

Yeah.

And what is he saying, like bump the fist or something like that?

Yeah, fist my b.

Fist my bump.

Yeah.

And so yeah, it's the perfect

marketing tool to have sold this fill of me.

It

latched on to like so many people, so many different audiences, you know.

You have the hard science fiction fans.

But then you also have the fans who like just love cool science

fiction, like in general.

You know, they' not like, they're not really like hard science

fiction fans or fantasy science fiction fans.

They just love science fiction.

Yeah.

And then you get the crowds who are just into like, like a cool, like set of kind of

blockbuster possibly, you know?

And it kind of was.

Think about it.

The commercial success of this movie, I think,

is so interesting because, like you say, it's got the the

cute non-human mascot, but then it's got that emotional

story that pulls your heartstrings.

And like you bring that together and it just, it works so great.

I don't know.

Jordan's.

It's also kind of like a great movie for the times that that we're in, right?

Yeah.

You know, like People coming together.

People coming together, like bringing people coming together in

the the face of like, like great odds, you know?

Like impossible odds.

You think about like a movie like The Watchmen.

They're faced with like, like this earth shattering of earth

ending threat.

And people need to get together, you know?

But this is not as cynical of a take.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah.

The was for like a more cynical perspective for Sean.

There were some cynical stuff like when they talked about like how, you know, like the

the 30% of the population would

die from starvation, but then she goes, you know, that's only

that's if people come together and we know that they won't.

And so that's more like more like 50% of a.

What's 30% of 8 billion?

Does Jordan, you're good with math.

Hell of a lot.

It's got to be like.

It's 2.

2.5 billion4 billion.

Ah.

No bueno.

There you go.

That's not good at all.

Yeah.

Well, honestly, so the beginning and

the trailer sort of reminded me, I don't know if it was the music, the cinematography, or both of

like how 2001 is Space Odyssey.

When that first came out, it was like they didn't tell you everything.

They gave you little blips of what it was sort of going to be about,

but something about the music with the cinematography,

I don't know why it reminded me of that at the beginning.

It was sort of like, I'm interested

I don't know what it's about, but I'm interested enough to stay and find out.

I feel like for me, the trailer,

there's this idea in like, in narrative

craft where you have to have the promise of the premise, you know?

And so like what Rocky represents is that this is fundamentally

like a first contact story.

And like the author Andy Weir, he has like an entire encyclopedia

a separate of like rocky biology and Aridian,

like their science and how they think and how their language works and everything.

And so like, to hide like the central idea of

the story, to give people like the wrong sense of like what this

movie is about, I think would be like a mistake because you get the wrong people in the theaters.

So like, yeah, I think at the end of the day, like they have to have Rocky

People have to know that's like what they're signing up for.

in there.

I'll's a little alien here.

Oh.

He's cute.

What did I want to talk about?

Proer Tail Mary is the movie we're discussing.

HLP, by the way, ordered the book, so that's coming to HLP here pretty soon.

You're going to love it.

You're going to love it.

It's the most accessible form of hard science fiction out there.

That's what I wanted to talk about.

Andy Weir does tons of research for all his books

books.

The Martian, I mean, my goodness, that I read that book, too, and saw the movie.

And in that book as well, it's like, here's the process of how I figure this thing out.

And I read a thing.

I think I talked to you, Jordan, about this, that people love

stories where the main character is an expert

and you get to see the progress and the breakdown of how they do their stuff.

So it's called like, what do I call?

process porn or something like that. competetency.

Competency. porn, yeah.

Yeah.

And extremely competent people doing very well at their craft.

Yeah.

I could see the appeal to that, you know.

And, is the other thing?

Like on the 18, is that like competency porn when they're like building all this stuff?

Same thing with like my favorite is Yeah, I's to say

MacGyver, a stick of gum in a paper.

Even Breaking Bad had a little bit of that, where Walter Watt was

always in a sticky situation and he had to figure out his way to get out of it.

I would argue Star Trek The Next Generation was one of the earliest examples of that

where like, everyone's an expert, everyone's professional.

There's like no interpersonal severe trauma.

It's like everyone doing the best they can to like solve the situation.

And at the end, Jean-Luc Picard gives some inspiring

rousing speech that convinces the aliens not to kill them.

So Inspector Gadget wouldn't be.

Well, that's the opposite.

That's a deconstruction of confidence Ford.

Deconstruction porn.

That's interesting.

Don't Google it that.

Don't go.

If we're doing that, then Austin Powers is too.

Come on, man.

I mean,

there's another one.

Yeah.

He can always give.ody of Bond where Bond is like the

male fantasy of like hyper-competency.

Yeah.

I was thinking about the idea of

like the non-human mascot is always more, like

Grogu, like you said, popular, Rocky, Dungeon

Cer Carl, which Jordan and I have been reading, you know, Princess Don

for those of you that know that series.

The fan favorite, yeah.

Fan favorite.

So What is it about non-human sidekicks

or mascots that like, it seems to, I don't know, people gravitate to stories like that, you know?

I mean, all of them have some innocence to them.

At least the examples that you've mentioned, there's kind of, they're

removed from like the trials and tribulations of like the fully

sentient human person and all the troubles that they're mired in.

I also feel like there's, so there's this thing that, uh,

the reason I was, I used to collect Funko Pops.

I haven't collected them in years.

But there was this this

study that kind of like talked about how

when it comes to

things like that, it's the

cuter the thing, and the more adorable it is,

the moral you want to like relate to it

in the way that in a sense of like wanting to take care of it

you know?

So it's this thing where that's why like you look

at things like Funko Pops.

They're supposed to be like superheroes, but they're kind of adorable at the same time.

You kind of want to like baby them in a way.

And the same thing with like, you know, like as simple as like

a baby doll, you know, like a baby doll that's like that kids

carry around or teddy bears, you know, like it's

that sort of human nature to like, want to care for something.

So I think that's that's that whole connection.

You look at like even in Star Wars, like not just

Grogu, but like the Ewoks.

That's why they did that Revenge of theurn of the Jedi

did as well as it did because, you know,

they were kind of wanted to market it towards getting kids in this way.

They wanted to do Chewbacca's home planet, but

they're like, no, let's just do cutesy bear-like creatures.

Yeah.

And we'll save on a little bit of budget because we just need to hire kids.

You don't have to hire a bunch of tall people.

Well, and Groot.

I mean, how many times?

Well, I mean, that's..

Yeah.

Rocky Raccoon.

Kind of cute.

There you go.

The other thing is, they

give us like at least the examples that Adrian brought up.

They give us a person.erspective of ourselves from the outside.

Like each of these people

each of these creatures from their innocence are like judging us

or judging the main character and reflecting on the main character.

And like Grogu especially through all this seasons

is like growing and like showing the Mandalorian,

like his own side of himself that he didn't know he had.

I feel like that's like the niche. refction of the empathy

and, you know, that compassion that

that theses people inherently have.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, back with all of.

Oh, sorry, go ahead.

Sorry.

All of these that we've mentioned, there's a vulnerability.

And I think that, you know, we're like, any kind

of alien, anything, you think, oh, they're all knowing,

they know more than, you know, humans or whatever.

But finding that vulnerability and being like, oh,

they might have more knowledge than us, but there

is still a vulnerability that they're depending on they're human.

And I think that's the part where we'll go, oh, okay.

Well, that's kind of cute.

And that's what pulls at the heart strings.

You're like, he isn't indestructible.

So

Actually, Lisa, to your point in

the Hail Mary book, there's a long section

about them learning each other's language, right?

And like figuring out the translation system and whatever.

It's way more, obviously, way more thorough and way more detailed

through this like first contact learning the language.

And like

I feel like it reflects a large part of that.

Like I heard this amazing hot take online where there were like

the story of Rocky and Grace learning about each other is like

the reverse typical alien story where like

Grace is the one who has these like miraculous powers that he can see the stars

that he has he can like survive in these impossible conditions

that he can go out on an EV suit and like Rocky can't do any of those things.

It's like for Rocky, it's like us finding an alien

that's like magical and more powerful than them.

You know, he has like special technology that they can't fathom.

And so, yeah, I don't know.

It's like the, his vulnerability is almost like the audience

perspective to like see humans as the alien.

That's awesome.

I'll have to go back and read the book now because the language piece

was really, I enjoyed that probably the most..

Watching them, you know, talk about like, or discover how to communicate with each other.

And I just, every single time, it doesn't matter how many times

I heard it in the movie, the way he inverted some of the typical language phrases

I just was, I kept going like, oh my God, that's cute.

That's cute.

But they't so upset by that, too, because it was, I mean, like, sorry.

They did great.

It was fun, and it was cute.

But I was like, movies like a rival did such a good job of like exploring with the real

like the mystery of a truly alien language and how you can bridge that.

And I felt like Andy We did such a good job at that and I was like excited

for that scene, for that part of it.

And I wanted them to do more of that.

I would I would have taken an extra half hour of the film to get more of the language part.

I was I was such an essential core of it, you know?

I was waiting for that.

They solved the language thing in like

a flash.

It's like a montage.

It's quick.

I was like, wait a minute.

Where's all the cool science, it's fine.

It's so quick.

I think it's cool though that they kind of Easter rigged it all throughout the film.

Even at the very beginning when he

was in the class teaching how different sound waves

have different sound, like sound forms, you know, when he was teaching them.

and then you kind of like, then they get, you get to them

like learning each other's languages and things like that.

But then you get to the end and he goes onto his ship onto Rocky's ship.

And you realize that like everything is controlled by sound waves.

Like the whole ship is just kind of like, it

Yeah.

Like he was touching like the different

strings and plucking him and it was like controlling the ship.

Oh, that's.

And then also when he says goodbye, they don't like wave or anything.

They have that like those markings on their

arm and it like kind of like, like as it feels like

like a, I don't know if the name of it is a vibrhone, but it's like a rhythm sort of

instrument.

Because he doesn't have I. That's right.

Yeah.

So everything's like, oh, like sound wave and like like a bat.

A sonar.

Son, yeah.

That's right.

Yep.

And in the book, they explained

more in detail about Rocky's physiology, don't they, Jordan?

Like they talk more about

his physiology because of

the way the atmosphere on his planet and like,

that's why they don't have eyes because eyes wouldn't evolve on the planet that he's from.

And they touch a little bit on that.

Yeah, like, he doesn't need a face and they're like radially oriented and it makes sense.

I mean, like, you see in the film, I believe you see that their planet is like

dark and cloudy and whatever, except for the dome

that they put Grace in spoilers.

Right.

But they also show show you Rocky's PLV, and it's kind of like a

weird Lydar, black and white, blobish looking.

It was like the, what the Dark Knight or whatever?

And that's not in the book privacy.

I don't think they ever tell us in the book how Rocky Sees

They only I think they do.

right?

I think they do talk about the sonar method of the fidelity

because they talk about him building the device to translate

like a tactile surface version of

the monitors that Grace has installed so he

can feel like what's happening or like see through

the sonar, what's happening outside the.

So this is kind of the interesting thing too.

It's like this whole discussion so far

is the perfect example of why,

you know, I don't really see like

books being better than the film or films being better than the book.

It's all just a different perspective because there's

certain things that you can't get in put in context

in a film and vice versa.

Like a prime example is this.

It's like when you write when you read Spider-Man, you

know, there's a lot of internal dialogue, but you can't really put that in film.

You could have a voiceover.

That comes off like way different Yeah than

Yeah.

like, in inner monologue.

Inner monologue is way different than a narration.

It's not just a narration, you know?

I can't imagine Tom Holland and I felt my spid sense teens tingling.

Like, I can't imagine that at all in those movies.

He's reading, he's doing the audiobook version of Spider-Man.

That's him.

Well, and the strength of film is the spectacle, right?

Like, it was so much cooler.

I feel like they don't even describe what the Hail Mary looks

like, like the actual like, shape of the ship.

They describe, like, the functions of it.

A rocky ship the book.

But the yeah, of like what the Hail Mary kind of looks like.

And I don't know if this is like a reimagining that they did for

the film or if there's like a brief description somewhere in the novel, but it was very cool.

I thought it was a very cool ship.

It was very cool to look at and like, Rocky's

ship, of course, is like impressive and terrifying somehow.

And like you don't get that spectacle.

That's the one thing that I'm like, the movie was like so cool

to see it alive, executed well, you know?

Now let me ask you guys this, because obviously,

like all that research of the technology and stuff is great.

But this movie, in my opinion, would not work if

the Rocky Riley Grace

friendship doesn't work.

Like, I feel like the entire emotional core of this movie

reles on that so much.

And I know the movie also has like with Sandra Her's character,

like there's that scene in the bar and stuff, which is great and emotional, but

like, really, it's it's it's a buddy movie, right?

And and Jordan as a fellow book reader, do you feel like the movie

captured their dynamic between Rocky and Robin as well as the book?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, yeah, there's nothing else to say about that.

That's like, the emotional core of both pieces.

It's like, if you didn't have Rocky there, it'd be like some really sad,

depressing, like, void narrative about, like a guy lost.

Like, it would be like... perfect for like a Soviet

era, black and white sci-fi

you know, ponderous thing that you like.

And then he died alone.

I'm like, I know myself so that.

If I woke up in Riley Grace's position, I'd be like, no, I'm not going to do anything.

We're all going to die..

Give me the.

Because I can't save the world.

Yeah.

I'm not going to figure this out.

I'm not a programmer.

I'm not an anthropologist.

I'm not a scientist.

I'm not an astronaut.

Like, for me.

Well, I thought it was interesting, the choice that they picked, that it was a teacher.

Right.

There you go.

That's true.

I mean, as a teacher

you know, we're in the position that we have to make

the kids think that we know all about our subject.

We can answer any question.

You throw at me about this subject.

I will know it right then and there.

Yeah.

And so I think it's funny that he like came across as

to his students, like, you know, I know all these answers.

And then you put him there and all of his moments of like

why the heck did they pick me?

I'm just a teacher.

Yeah, I might be a good science teacher.

I'm just a teacher.

And so I just thought that that in and of itself was really funny.

And being a teacher, I'm like, man, put me in space and we would both die.

I wouldn't be able to figure it out

But I'm also not good at the technology.

So I thought it was interesting being a science teacher that he also knew

all of the technology and he figured it out.

And I'm like, that that is not always the case, just because

you're good at science doesn't mean you're also good at the technology, but,

I thought that that was an interesting choice, too, that they picked teacher.

They could have picked anything, put an electrician out in space.

Right.

They could figure it out

They could figure it out.

No, this is, I mean, this is such an interesting point.

Like, Lisa, you are as qualified as Rylylan

Grace to, like, be picked for this mission.

Like, tell us how..

Yeah.

You die.

Humanity dies.

I would let all of humanity down.

Right.

And it was interesting because

I don't know.

Did I miss, like, they, I,

maybe this is more in the book, why the

whole backstory boy they picked him.

Why him in particular

out of all the, how many, you know,

thousands or tens of thousands of science teachers, why did they not pick a college profession?

or?

Why did they not pick, you know, this teacher here?

Did they go into that?

And I missed that?

They went into it to know.

They went into it.

Okay.

It was at the very beginning of the film where like when he first meets

what's her name?

Sandra Roller's character.

Sandra Holler's character.

She enters the classroom and like asks

him about this paper that he wrote. at his old job.

And he like, it was all about like more

about the fact that he questioned his

the higherups authorities on the

thoughts of like, I can't remember what the paper was all about.

It was non-water-based life.

So he was like a potential expert for like this

type of alien organism that lives in a in in extremophile

conditions that maybe can't have water so that made him like a

expert on the alien.

Which he also finds out that they're like, what, 90% water?

He's like They's still water base.

Yeah, yeah.

But I could see that, but it still makes me wonder

he would not be the only person on the planet which he wasn't.

They went to.

They went?

He wasn't they actually had asked other

into it.

authorities on it.

Uh-huh.

It was a couple step process, right?

Because like first he was associated with the project because of the paper initiially, right?

And then they had everyone working on the samples,

but he was the one who figured out how to make them breed using like

high school, like a box and duct tape and whatever, right?

So then he became like the expert.

Yeah, he killed one.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

And then he still wasn't the chosen pick

but actually, they never talk about this in the movie.

This is something from the book.

There's like people who have a rare genetic condition that allows

them to be more likely to survive going into this ended coma state.

Yeah.

And so he's one of the people who has this genetic condition.

And because he's on the project, when they lose their main guy, because

of the explosion, the error in the dosage or whatever

um, they're like, listen, you know, you followed this project the entire time.

You know what we're doing.

You're like the most qualified person, and you have the genetic trait.

Like, we're not going to find another person like you..

I bet they spent like a lot of time in the book justifying why the guy.

I'm glad you're bringing this up because

it's interesting the changes they'll make in a movie for the drama.

Because in the movie, they like basically physically force him to be the one, right?

When he when they bring in They kidn.

Right.

They don't do that in the book.

If I remember correctly, Jordan, did?

No, I mean, they do they do.

He doesn't want to do it.

He figures out he's a coward.

Like, they kidnap him in the book, too, but there's no, like, dramatic

scene.

Right, I mean like it's more visually dramatic in the movie, I think.

Yeah, it's more visually dramatic in the film.

That's the takeaway.

And I think they could have they could have stood to like have more of that

exposition of about the genetic thing that he has.

I don't think they touched on that in the movie at all, did they?

I don't think they did, if I don't remember correctly.

No, I mean, like, well, this is another benefit of having the film, right?

They visually show it.

The people waking up from something with the giant arm bot above them.

So you have the idea that, like, oh, they were under some sort of sleep state, but obviously

he wanted to be, Andy, we wanted to be practical.

So it's not Cryo.

There's no sort of like suspended animation or anything.

They're literally just an induced medical coma, which is,

yeah, I was, I worry about people who only saw the film where it's

like, well, the other two people died, but like, is that?

And it's it's because it's like a probability thing of

like a long-term, like seven years induced coma or whatever.

Well, if you could think about it, too.

It's it's if they had put in that context, right?

You're getting into a prequel realm of like Star Wars.

You know what I mean?

Like in Star Wars, they explain why people are become

Jedi. min min the metrians, right?

And it's like kind of like that kind of nerdy thing that we we love

but like the wider audience, the broader mainstream

obviously,ience isn't going to care much about, you know, it's like, who cares?

Like they're genis, you know?

But at the same time, it's like it's interesting to like have it explained

to like It was like, oh, cool, they have like this thing that's

preternaturally in like certain people, you know?

And I think that's just kind of a

cool detail, but at the end of the day, you are trying to sell it visually, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And visually, I'm glad you even say that word because visually it's such a beautiful movie.

That scene where he goes out, oh, what was the context?

It's been a few months, but with the red lighting and stuff

and it's like a different, what is he doing there?

What was the context of that?

Again, he's watching it through a different filter or something and then

they shoot it in a way where it's like red, light and Yeah,

yeah, because it's the, it's the wavelength to see the petrova line.

And so the particles are like the individual cells like illuminated in that

I never imagin that in the.

When they go into that, that dome, that area where he's like

showing Rocky, like, here's, here's Earth's sky, here's the water.

That had me bawling.

Yeah.

You know, when he's sharing that because I thought that visually too.

At first, the way they filmed it was interesting because

it wasn't just dead on.

It was like almost like a vertigo thing where they would show the

top of the dome and then they would show down here.

They didn't just do a boring dead on shot, but how they filmed that was amazing.

And that was that was a really cool thing.

He brought it back several times too.

It wasn't just one scene of that.

So

Yeah.

That reminded me me of sunshine.

You know, they' like, do you remember like the habitat they had in

sunshine for so they don't go stir crazy?

That wasn't in the book, right?

That that video room with the screens.

I don't remember that being.

I don't remember it.

I don't remember that in the book.

Like, feel free to correct us in the chat, but oh, yeah.

But then, yeah, that was beautiful.

That like the whole film was was shot in like such a not

sci-fi way, you know?

Yeah.

It was almost like a, like a ponderous, like character piece

kind of thing, especially the like before

he leaves, like the long walking bundle in a coat,

like foggy overcast skies, like

long shots and things that it felt like a different kind of film almost.

It was like beautiful in some of its slowness.

Sci-fi is interesting that way.

I feel like a lot of the big sci-fi movies is either like flat,

but bright lighting or like something super dark and dramatic.

You think about Alien versus 2001.

Right?

2001 is like, it's got a lot of bright light.

Alien is dark and grungy.

This movie is colorful.

It's not flat.

It's colorful.

There's high contrast.

It's not grungy at all.

I don't know.

I just love the cinematography.

I always talked about the cinemography.

Yeah, the green planet.

The green and

I could have mentioned it that well in my mind when I read the book, you know?

Yeah.

It also didn't have the hyperactivity of like the Abrams

Star Trek reboot, though, either, right?

Yeah.

Like that, I like that visual style.

I know a lot of people hated that.

I like that visual style, but boy, was that, I'm glad they didn't do that here.

You know, no, like excess lens flare, every shot's moving, whatever.

Spielberg Vaseline on the lens and every light is blooming.

Yeah, no, they didn't do that here.

But yeah, visually it's a beautiful film.

The Rocky character was mostly practical.

I believe that they built a puppet that for certain shots that they could actually

animate in person.

And I think they just CG'd the ball thing over him.

I believe is what they did based on behind scenes.

Yeah, sometimes.

I think I saw some behind the scenes where parts of the ball are practical and

sometimes it's not there, so I think it might have been a shot to shot kind of thing.

But yeah, I definitely saw like the guy with the sticks behind him in the full, the full

whatever, the one man..

Lisa, the what's that called in acting?

Oh, the green screen stuff?

Where they' Like the full green screen, like, bodysuit thing for, like the operator guy.

Yeah, I can't remember what it's called, but where they're trying to blend

in with the background and you're like, but I still see you.

Yeah.

Like, don't look at me..

Did I see your head in that green spandex, you know, stocking.

Yeah.

So

but, I mean, I have to say, I, I was looking for that.

I hate to admit, I was looking for that.

I was looking to see the fakeness in Rocky and be like, okay, that's, yeah.

That's a cute claymation something.

And I, I liked it.

Whatever, however they did it, I liked it.

And it was believable.

And I

was like, at first, like I said, I was like, ooh, it looks like a spider I'm not a fan of it.

But afterwards I was like, I want my own Rocky.

Yeah.

I want my own thing that looks like a spider that is in a hamster ball that doesn't have eyes.

And my husband was like, you, okay.

All right.

And also another realistic thing they did, and I

think Jordan, you'll appreciate this is that like ships in real life would be

more like skyscrapers and not like, you know, se

ships because it makes sense to build like a skyscraper because the way gravity works against the gravity

versus the shipping. specifically.

Trust gravity..

It's if you're using that versus the spinning button.

Yeah, this is a super interesting conversation.

Yeah.

There's two versions of this ship and like when I'm writing science sci-fi, you have to think about these things constantly.

If you, if you don't want to do like artificial gravity, right?

And so like when initially when you have thrust coming out one end, you want a stacked orientation.

So like if the ship is like this way, you have to have the floors perpendicular.

Yeah, the skyscraper orientation.

Because then you're using thrust.

If you have one of thrust, then you get normal gravity when you're inside the ship, right?

But then when you're stopped

and the book goes so much more in detail into this,

you have to have like a spinning pendulum.

So like one end extends out and then it spins around the shared

point in the axis and then you're using centripetal gravity.

And so you can spin it and you can get like half a G or up to one G.

And so, and that was specifically, so they could use all the advanced

scientific equipment for his analysis

because it was better to operate something like an electronic microscope

under normal Earth gravity than try to develop a

new type of electron microscope that could work in zeroG, right?

Not just about like muscle atrophy, but also just like the tools that he's working with.

Semmi-unrelated, but in the Star Trek shows that you watched throughout

the years, do they ever explain the artificial gravity or they just gloss over it every time?

This is the funniest thing.

Not only do they never explain artificial gravity, but the ship could

be almost completely destroyed, you know, like

life support failing, every other system failing, but boy, does that artificialural gravity still work?

Everyone's still, you know, nailed to the floor.

The water system that never fails..

Come on.

You know, that's hard to do.

Yeah, yeah.

It's expensive to do is what it is.

Right, exactly.

Yeah.

But if you watch The Expanse, which is a great series of books and

TV show, you'll see that they don't mess around with that artificial gravity stuff.

They don't mess around with that.

Stay true to physics

Even when the budget constraints start to show themselves, at least they have mag boots, you know?

And they're walking around.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

We never get to discuss scipeline on this show, so I'm glad we get to discuss it now.

You, j.

Arnold can just be like twirling his hips every 30 minutes.

And they' be like trying to get into it..

I know.

I know.

Yeah, yeah.

He can perform centripetal forces for us.

That's true.

Exactly.

No, what a great movie, though.

What else, guys?

I mean, there's so much going on in this movie.

I really recommend the book.

The book, by the way, is an accessible read.

I I don't think it's like..

Ed Reid doesn't write complex pros.

He may do a lot of research about a scientific concept that's like kind

of niche, but like the writing is accessible, I think, right?

He walks you through the process..

He's only They used to call this engineers fiction, right?

Which is almost like a derogatory term for like hard

sci-fi, where like the science plays a crucial role in the

plot and where like the science has to be rigorous and true to the real world

with very little wiggle room, right?

And so like this is like the most accessible, hard sci-fi,

I think, that exists today to Andy W's credit.

And like, if you watch this movie and at any point you were like, that's bunk.

This doesn't make sense.

I was confused at this point.

Or like, how did that work?

Go read the book.

Because it has all the answers for you.

There's like zero plot holes in the book.

The most cynical thing I read after I read the book

was, there's no way all the world governments would

get together to do all that and try to like that's the most

fiction-y part of this science fiction is that the world would come together, you know, for the greater good.

And I was like, you know what?

Considering the circumstances, yes, actually, I could see it.

This is the only big sci-fi movie that came out this year, by the way, right?

I feel like

we don't get that many big studio sci-fi films anymore.

Jordan.

Oh, yeah.

I think you wanted to touch on this.

We were talking about, are we in a gold era?

Are we approaching the golden era?

I hope so.

This is honestly, like, in the world of literature and for like science

fiction and for someone who's like in the query trenches right now for like sci-fi novels

and manuscripts, like, sci-fi is so down in the dumps.

Like, very few people are reading it.

Very few people are stalking in it in bookstores.

And like, so like this grand spectacle, I really hope

reopens the golden age of good science fiction

and not just like monster thriller stuff, like with like a science

fiction sheen on it, but like real

like the of science fiction that we used to enjoy.

In fact, I was at a writer's conference a couple months ago

and I got to talk to a literary agent there and I asked them

the question, I was like, is the success of Project Hail

Mary going to convince people

that there is like a large market for science fiction, both

in like the literary and the film world.

And they were like

probably in the film world.

I don't know about in like the world of books, not necessarily.

So, I mean, we'll see, but, I mean, like this plus

like Dune, uh, the Dune trilogy, I guess now,

the third one coming out, I really do hope we see kind of,

and like, if it's big in the movies, then it'll trickle down

and we'll see like more interest in in

in written work.

And then maybe we'll get something like the golden Age of

sci-fi lit, even when it was pulpy from like the 60s and 70s, you know?

Yeah, because if I go to the bookstore, the sci-fi section is that big,

and then next to it is Star Wars and then fantasy and

then fantasy wraps around the other side.

It's like three more shelves.

Three more shelves of romantic, horror, thriller

Lots of manga, for some reason.

I've seen way more manga now, but when I go to

the library and like, or the bookstore and like, I look in that

thin sliver of a sci-fi section, like a third of the books in there are like just fantasy.

I'm like, this is not a sci-fi book.

Excuse me.

s.

What do you think?

So what do you with the science fiction background?

What do you think Project Hail Mary compares to?

Like, in terms of, like in the last 10 years that,

you know, any science fiction movies that have, or even the last 20 years,

what would you compare it to in magnitude then?

Oh, on on the scale of, like a popularity scale?

Well, popularity, but just like a cinematic masterpiece.

Or, you know, however you want to rate it, what

would you, what would you compare it to in the last 20 or 25 years?

Like, it rivals this.

I mean, the easy answer is the Martian because the same author.

Yeah.

In some ways, like a similar premise of like, you know, can you get home?

Can you save yourself?

But, but on the scale of.

I mean, I don't know.

I don't know actually if the box office reflects, you know, the fact that I

watched it more than once or if like the

small niche of like super fans kept it afloat and fed it as.

I know it was a success.

I know it didn't flop.

Yeah, yeah.

And I don't know, maybe, maybe Boots too big, our researcher

can like figure out, the box office value of it.

But I mean, I feel like it was, I don't know if there's,

it's hard because there's a lot of properties kind of like Marvel adjacent or

like more like science fantasy or like Guardians of the Galaxy or whatever

that are like big, but they' like part of a tententpole And this one's very much standalone.

Like even for the author, this is like a completely standalone

universe that he wrote for that like does not have a

sequel in it at all that like made it all the way.

And like the popularity for something that's like a standalone property and that doesn't

have any sort of existing IP around it is like really hard to

achieve, I think.

So it's like kind of a standout.

I would say it's kind of a standupout.

I don't know if anyone else can think of examples of things that are like comparable.

I mean, to this, HLP

says Sunshine, but that was more of a horror.

Well, it's.

I' trying to throw a horror.

It says in the last 10 years?

I think I think that came out early 2018s 2017?

Yeah, it was like 2010 sometime.

I'm sure of my favorites Sunshine was.

Was that the one that where he was like

a kid was evil?

No.

No.

It's a Danny Boyle film.

The sun is also dying in that one.

Yeah, the sun is dying.

Okay.

And it's like a last ditch effort of the Icarus 2

sent to restart the sun, which a bunchs of the style material.

Yeah, and it follows the crew as like every possible thing goes wrong.

People are picked off one by one.

It a villain there from the lost

Icarus one, the first failed mission and the mystery of that..

It's very like

yeah, like you said, it's very horror.

It's very, like dark.

It's very, it's like, again, like an against all odds, do

whatever it takes to save your species and like your life is forfeit or

whatever, but it is it is not optimistic or positive

or like hopeful in the way, except for like maybe like the right

before the credits it gets a little hopeful.

What about But also it wasn't that successful.

I feel like Sunshine was completely buried.

My recollection is it kind of flocked when it came out.

Like most people I talked to about it, I'm like, this is one of my favorite films.

And they're like, I've never heard of it.

How do you feel it relates to, because one

thing that I, when I was watching it, even though it had an additional crew in it, The Ayss.

Do you guys remember The Abys where it was that

otherworldly, like, you know, there's creatures, some of them see it.

And it was interesting because I saw

I felt like there were some parallels there, at least at the very end.

You know, I know, I would say there's a traditional

type of sci-fi that follows that that genre that

format and like Alien did this too, where it's

very much like, here we are, we're in a, in a space

where everything's going wrong and it's survival kind of

in the cloister, isolated conditions of one ship

or one base or one station or whatever.

And like, either it's picking everyone off one by one until like the last survivor.

It follows very much like the horror structure.

And I feel like through the 80s, 90s,

early 2000s, 2010s, there was a lot, a lot of sci-fis

and like life was another one.

I think it was called that follows that kind of like formula.

That was also a cosmic horror.

Yeah.

Yes.

Yeah, Cosmic Horror is.

Yeah.

What's the one with Sam Neal in it?

Event Horizon.

Event Horizon follows that.

And I feel like Project Hail Mary

is completely not that.

It's almost like a buddy comedy, buddy pop,

you know, stop the bad guy..

It's refreshing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I will love, I will always take a pick off everyone

until one person remains sci-fi, but like this was I like this.

This was different.

This was a genrere I've not seen, a format I have not seen, at least in this style

I think that's an interesting thing, though.

It's a lot of like these genre films, per se.

They all everything kind of seems to be blending together.

And there's no like real purity in like the genres anymore.

Like, even horror, you look at like like a film like

like back rooms.

That's a horror film, but it's also kind of like,

you know, psychological thriller and things like that.

And then you look at Obsession and it's kind of this sort of like

horror comedy kind of thing going.

And it our

friend Director Patrick had mentioned this, that horror

is going to be this huge thing right now going in this year, but it's going to be a lot of

mixed genres.

It's never going to be this pure sort of thing.

And I think that's the same thing with sci-fi and it's gotten to that point now.

But you even see that with superhero films,

you know, they'll take a superhero film and then they'll drop

it into like a political espionage thing or like it's a sci-fi thing

You know, it's never really this pure thing.

And I think that's important to

note that that's what kind of happens

when you are trying to progress any sort of thing.

You know, you in order to

create new audience or bring people in

from different audiences, you kind of have to like hook them in

with something that's that they're accustomed to.

And all the speak from the perspective

of literary agents, there's very much like

everyone on their manuscript wish list has like genre fusions,

like break convention of genre, give us this genre meets this genre.

Like everyone's looking for that in the pipeline. and then those books

are getting written and then Hollywood deals are picking it up and then they're

getting this like weird genre fusion on their end as well.

This is why I want to see a tour directors like Wes Anderson

do a sci-fi horror or something completely outside of their wheelhouse, right?

And this is why I want to see.

Spiberg sci-fi horror.

Spielberg needs to do a small budget family drama or something.

You know what I mean?

A rom-com.

A rom-com.

Exactly.

And I don't know, like Tarantino should do Tarantino should do a sci-fi.

You imagine a sci-fi movie written by Tarantino

with the way he writes dialogue and shit?

Space

Yeah, so let's

like mixed and match, not just genres, but a tour directors as well, and and

even writers like, Aaron Sorkin, fuck it.

Write a horror movie.

Write as a sci-fi horror movie.

Lots of walking talks, but, you know.

Sork.

It's funny.

You were talking about, I, I got to digressed too much,

but the week that you guys discussed Obsession

I did watch it and I

was discussing this with someone, how it wasn't

just horror, talk about the mixed genre.

It was really a deep dive into a lot of mental health issues too.

And we were talking about how like it's this weird, there's

a lot of these like horror slash mental health things that are out now

And so that, you were talking about the mixed genre.

That was, that was pretty, first of all, that was terrifying.

I had nightmares for many nights.

But that was also a mixed genre with a lot of mental

health things and a lot of communities are talking about, oh my gosh, think about the mental health aspects of that.

And I was like, that's that's interesting because a lot of people will just take it as just pure horror.

But this, I agree.

It's like a feel good family, you know,

it's science fiction, but I think everybody can relate to it.

You take kids to go see it and they're going to, you know, as long as

they're old enough to be able to maintain attention, they're going to see and

focus on Rocky and that story.

And other people will see it and focus on the science side of it.

You know, is it true to what it should be?

And then other people will go for the

you know, the more of the tech part of it.

So I think it's something that appeals.

As a teacher, you, I think we've touched on this before.

You sort of have your finger on the pulse of the vibe with

the current generation of kids and stuff.

Do you think that this movie is good for the current cultural climate we're in?

You know, and how kids are sort of

I don't know, just taking in all this negative energy from everything going.

I don't know.

Like, do you, does that make sense at all?

Like, do you think Yeah, yeah, I do.

And I mean, if it were something that I would show

in the classroom, I think that

some of the discussion points that I would want to bring up is like,

first of all, it's a great story and it's kind of cliche of,

you can come from two different backgrounds, two different worlds, know nothing about each other

be drastically different from literally two different worlds

and universes, galaxies, whatever you want to say, and

still find commonality and still work together.

Because I think that that is a core message

of this, that no matter what you see it for

I think that's a message to walk away with.

And the fact you brought up, like sort of people were like, yeah,

but really what all these governments actually come together to do this?

And I think right now is the perfect climate, unfortunately,

for that, of like, yeah, they might be fiction

in here, but this is maybe, like, I think it

would be great for friendly controversy in a classroom.

Like, what do you think?

What do you think,

how does this relate to real life right now?

Our current climate, political, social, economic, any of it.

But I think the core story of come

from two different worlds and they are coming together to solve a problem.

No, that's great.

Thank you for that perspective.

I ask is just as a parent myself, and just

hearing about like the literacy rate is down across the board

and it's just, it's kind of scary because, and this is also a very cynical

thing that I've heard, but it's true that when they are deciding where

to build the next prison, they look at the third grade reading level in that area and

they're like, oh, it's really bad in this area.

That's where the next prison is going to be built.

Because theacy to prison pipeline is real, unfortunately.

Well, and the hard thing is, I mean, I think we've talked about this before.

COVID did huge damage

As teachers, we knew that that teaching online was not the way we learned.

That's just not the way humans learn.

There is a very minute population that that's they do well online.

But even for, you know, things like math, even reading,

it's a hands-on thing, even if you're not physically hands-on, you need to be there in person.

There's There's a personal, we have something

with our district called Personal relational competencies

that we are now focusing on.

And it's part of like what we look at.

It's not just, here's the math targets, here's the literacy targets.

It's, can you be in a classroom and can you work with another person?

Can you work in a small group?

Can you come to a decision on something

And we've lost a lot of that in COVID.

And we're struggling, even, you know,

six years, whatever past, we're struggling to get that back.

Why doesn't someone say, just get rid of the tablets out of the classroom, back to paper and pencil?

Like, why doesn't somebody just say that?

A lot of educators are trying to do that.

And I think it depends because we were talking about this earlier.

Like, you have Claude, you have the AI.

And it's very helpful.

It is very helpful.

It's really hard to argue that there isn't a use for it.

But

I think that there is an

evolution of teachers that are getting back to, let's just use paper and pencil.

I mean, my district and others are like, here is the mass curriculum.

It's a book.

And it now has a paired workbook with it, which is kind

of crazy because a lot of them are like, what's a workbook?

We've gotten away from that in the last two or 15 years, and now

we're back to, let's use a workbook.

Let's make those paper copies.

Let's

you know, or use whiteboards as they're looking on the screen and we'll all do it together.

There is still a part of the human brain that like wrote memorization, writing it down.

I mean, there's science to that.

The reason why we took notes is because that's the connection.

That's who you, a lot of kids learn things.

A lot of adults learn things by writing it down when I'm memorizing, you know, lines

I write it down.

I copy it.

I write it different places.

And there is just a connection there that you can't deny that Chromebooks just can't do.

Right.

Let's think of how aesthetic the classroom will be if we go back to like the green

you know, the old green blackboards and like

the foldout, like the wooden desks, you know, and like big chocolate pencils.

That's the look I want.

Well, and even if you don't do the chalkboard, even

just doing dry race...

It's kind of interesting because even something like dry race versus paper.

On paper, there's a certain permanency.

Yes, you can erase it, but it's a little bit harder.

Dry has taken that permanency away, so we can just

write whatever we want because we just and it's gone.

Whereas on paper, there's more permanence.

And I try to tell students like, it's okay.

Make a mistake.

Please make a mistake.

How do they respond to that?

Like, what do they say?

Well, they first look at me like I've grown a couple of extra heads.

Like, why do you want me to make a mistake?

But we focus on error analysis because

even if you don't have the right answer, if you can talk me

through in your brain what clicks and goes, wait, something doesn't look right.

Even if you can't get the right answer, if you can recognize that

there might be a problem, that will get you much further,

because then you can always go research what the problem is.

But if your brain doesn't even tell you that there might be a problem there,

if you just put it down and you're like, I'm not going to even challenge it to think, is that right

For example, even something is simple,

and yes, we do have older students that don't

have any number sense. trying to teach angles.

We were talking about, you know, acute and a two angles, one's less than 9, one's greater than 90.

And you can't measuring an angle to do geometry if you don't understand

that 82 is smaller than 112.

And we have lost the ability to gauge that, which is wild.

I want them to sit with it. and say,

prove to me that that's right, right or wrong.

You tell me, because we've become so accustomed

to an adult telling you, yes, it's right or no,

it's wrong, and not sitting with it and figuring out for yourself.

Is that right?

And why?

This is a great parallel to the movie as well, right?

Because like

Grace relies on the computers and the systems,

but Rocky has like this innate knowledge he can do extremely complex math in his head.

And so they never needed to develop computer systems as like this crutch.

And like, even now, back to the era of Socrates,

there every little step is an additional crutch that we're

taking a portion of our mind and our thinking and we're externalizing it.

And now we're dependent on that tool.

Like our storytelling is no longer like long

orated histories passed down and memorized.

Now it's a thing that's like stored somewhere that can be lost and

that has to be like recovered and read and like translated.

And so like AI is like another, like a huge leap, but another

step of like removing some of that authority

of our own like mental acuity and handing it off to something else.

And we have to, I think each one of those steps needs to be like a very

intentional decision that we make for like which parts are we willing to hand off.

Just one quick thing I wanted to say about all that.

And thank you you, by the way.

That's a great perspective, Lisa.

I know it's not, it's related to the movie in kind of a long way, but you know what I mean?

It's still a great perspective to have.

Really quick.

We were talking about Sunshine earlier, and I just clicked on it on Letterbox.

And then, you know how on Letterbox there's like lists that people make.

Sunshine is in a list called, and I just I have to read this because it's fantastic.

Cycleual dramas, nihilistic fever dreams, and surrealism with a touch of humor.

Ooh, that maybe I should see what else is in that list.

Suspi possession.

Oh, yeah...

Is I want your Sex in that list?

I don't see it, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Dude, I need to watch more movies.

There's so many movies on here that look interesting that I have never seen

which is the name of the show.

But yeah, all right.

Well, you know, we talked about a lot of stuff.

I want to hear more about really

quick before we start to wrap up about Project H, Mary Jordan, any last

takeaways about this movie that you wanted to touch on before we start to wrap it up?

What do you think?

You know, to prepare for coming on to this podcast,

I listen to a certain song on repeat many times.

You can join me if you know the lyrics.

You know, it's just stop, you're crying.

It's a sign of the times.

I know that song.

Why Welcome to the final show.

That was the song that..

That's the theme.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's like the trailer song and like the main theme in the the karaoke.

The karaoke song that.

And the karaoke, yeah.

I literally have been listening to it on repeat.

It's so freaking good.

And you don't even have that in the book.

So.

You know what I mean?

Yeah, exactly.

That was made.

Although sometimes you'll see early writers putting like lyrics and

Yeah.

like, you know, songs in their manuscript. me ask you like, okay.

What did the movie do better than the book in your Europe and Jordan?

I mean, obviously the spectacle, the visuals.

Oh, the interactions.

The Rocky using the tools to build

things to build the, what is it, like solid Argon or something

that he's working with?

Yeah.

Like that was like not explored in the books.

And so like that was completely the the people who were building the props

and like showing him building things that was super cool.

like the specifics of how the ball worked,

his like hamster ball, and like the inside of his ship.

Like, I don't even remember in the book if they go into Rocky's ship or if there's anything described about it.

Do you remember?

It's very little.

I remember very little very brief. the very end of the book too..

It's just like in the movie, he goes back to Rescue Rocky

and I think he goes in the ship very briefly.

Briefly, yeah.

But in the movie, it was so cool.

I don't remember.

And they explore it and it's like, and like, of course you have this

like tit for tat as part of the cultural exchange.

He's like showing them all the stuff in the ship and it feels really alien, but it also feels like so familiar

for Rocky and the way that he's moving through it.

I really enjoyed that part.

That was like worth seeing the movie just for those like The parallels are great too.

They both lost their crew.

Yeah.

Ryylan loses his crew because of, well, why did he lose his crew?

Just because of the unlikelihood of like a low survivability for the

the induced coma.

So And Rocky was kind of a lower ranking on his

ship, but he only survived because of a very technical. to the shielded engines.

And so that protected him from cosmic radiation.

That's right.

And they didn't understand about radiation and they were protected against it because

they have such a thick atmosphere on arid that they don't experience

as much normal solar radiation as like humans do.

So again, that goes back to the like hum

Yeah, and neither one of them really knew initially why they lost their crew.

Yeah.

You know?

So.

Yeah.

And because Rocky on his home planet, was he also an engineer or something?

He talks about it in the book.

I know that.

He says, like, oh, because they don't have like the same social

hierarchy that we do, but he does say he's kind of like the equivalence

of a scientist on his planet, I think.

Remember correctly.

But yeah, so interesting parallels there.

Lisa, did you have any last takeaways you wanted to talk about that we didn't touch on?

I mean, I really, really liked how they used

music and used sound as part of his ship

not just as language, but but like, I mean, the ship itself.

I really thought that that was when you mentioned before how, you know,

when he goes on to Rocky's ship and he, like touches it and you

can see that it relates to like sound waves and frequencies and all that.

I liked that.

I thought that was really clever.

you know, because they could have just made some cool ship and visually like, isn't that neat.

But I like how they used that.

And now I want to go back and read the book because I want to hear more description about it.

You'll love the book.

Yeah.

Alex, what about you?

Any Any final takeaways that you wanted to touch on?

I just, I just really appreciated this film

for the emotional depth that it it had.

The way it carried with the loneliness that they felt.

And you really feel that for grace

when he discovers, like, one, obviously he's like,

he discovers the body, the bodies of his crew.

And then

the way he's like kind of slowly backwards remembering

pieces of how he got there.

And you see him going through the that sort of depression.

Like it's like, well, I don't know where I'm at.

I don't

you know, I'm alone.

I'm and then he kind of like, you know,

after he he jettisens the bodies into space,

that's when you, he discovers like Rocky.

You know, that's the moment where he he realizes he's not alone.

He doesn't understand

what they're trying to get at at

first, but you see this kind of almost playful nature between

the two of them, even when he's like trying to get away from the ship, you see him stop.

And they're like right next to it.

That was so well done.

You see that Project K Mary you

go, and then the Rocky shit dispose.

That was so well done.

And it's's just so it's so great and it brings a lot of levity to the

to the film where you're like it

felt so heavy for so long up

to that moment because it's just like like like you're getting hit after hit after hit it.

And it just makes you feel bad for Grayson It's like, what's going to happen.

But then you find you find he finds connection almost almost instantly in a way

like that they both feel lonely.

And it's interesting to show how

they convey the loneliness that Rockies feeling.

You know?

He doesn't, you know, the

emotions aren't a thing.

Like in a sense that like categorize

how humans categorize it.

So the interesting part of like them

as they're creating, like learn each other's language, they're

understanding what what emotion is about and like, how to connect with each other.

Like when they go to hug,

you know, that one scene, like at the very, like on the end, he's like,

it's just, it's just, it's it's kind of that beaut beautiful thing, you know?

Like, you want to be able to like touch

the people you care about.

And they're doing their best that to do so, you know?

I like how they connect their's that really funny part

where he's like hiding and he's talking to himself.

Oh, yeah.

And he's like, what are you saying over there?

And I thought that was great.

That had me rolling on the floor.

Rocky can hear you.

Yeah, yeah.

And I like how like, they made it

a point to show that Rocky

still is learning the language and how to convey

a question versus a statement.

Yep.

He's like, Rocky is wondering question.

Question?

Yeah.

So many good moments like that.

And then I want to say, I gave it a four

and a half out of fun.

My only takeaways, I love the tension

tension with the scenes where they're scooping up

the astrophage from that one planet, the gas planet or whatever, and

they have to like not be there too long.

Eba.

Time Eba, because otherwise they'll get sucked into the gravity well of that planet.

So tense in the movie, really tense in the

book, but in the movie, my goodness, like that was a nail-biting scene.

I couldn't have imagined a way back a better way to do it than. how they did her in the movie.

It's funny you to bring that up, the tenseness of that scene.

It reminded me of when I was watching Obsession..

And I watched both of these movies in the theaters,

and I know like, like my body language,

when I'm watching a really tense scene, I tend I'm

in the movie the as I tend to just kind of like

I feel my body just kind of like come close to.

And I got that same feeling both

in obsession and in that scene where they they're trying to like

scoop up the towelf or whatever.

The tell me It's so well made, yeah.

Tell me even tell me that

It was so well made.

I just think they really nailed it it, man.

Like they really nailed.

If this was a standalone movie, if there was no book that it was based on, I still think it would be thrilling.

I still think it would have that same level of

of thrill that you got and then just the humor..,

you know, the book keeps the Hollywood people honest, you know?

It doesn't let them go off in like wild

ways that like filmmakers sometimes want to.

You know, my heart take is this that some writers will write,

knowing, having the Hollywood mindset a little bit, because they know, hey, maybe there's a chance this'll become a movie.

So let me...

Hey, listen, Andy Weir, every movie every book he's written has

been actioned, including Artemis that will like never see made, but

But all of them have been options.

So like I feel like at this point he knows.

He's like, yeah, this one's going to be a movie, whatever I'm writing.

All right.

Well, you know, I think there's a lot there we discussed.

Any, any

uh, should we do, what do you think, Jordan?

Should we do, what's the one thing you would change?

I think that's a good one, a good standing question.

Yeah.

Yeah, we'll start with I'm going to have an answer for you, but.

Don't start with me.

Do me last.

All right, Alex, is there anything that you would you.

I change?

Yeah, anything at all.

It could be the silliest thing.

I can't really think of anything, to be quite honest.

I think it's given my score that

I have for it four and a half out of five, it's a near

perfect..

I don't want to say perfect, but it's like, it's a fun film.

It's a very interesting like take on sci-fi.

I don't know, maybe a little bit more seriousness of it, you know?

Because there were certain scenes that kind of felt a little too

MCU-ish like the comedy.

The only thing I would change in Roger Tail Mary

more of Sandra Her, and I'll tell you why, because in the book, her

character is, every other chapter is kind of her character with

Rylan Grace, but like, there's chapters where she like goes before

district courts and like says, hey, don't sue me.

I'm trying to save the world here, so I don't really care about your

your legalal whatever stuff.

Like we're literally trying to save the world right now.

And she's like such a boss in the book and they don't they don't do that in the movie.

And it's like, it would have been nice because Sandra Her is such a good actress

and she just like, I don't know.

She has a she has a gravy toss on everything she's in.

Like she's going to be in the new Digger movie with Tom Cruise.

I don't know if you guys have watched the trailer for this movie.

But in that movie, the world is also kind of ending so it's like that's

two movies in the same year that Sandra Holler's in where the world is ending

and she has to like be involved.

So give me more Sandra Holler because her scenes in the book were great.

Jordan, you could probably attest to this as well.

I completely agree.

Yeah.

She's like such a badass and there's like this entire series on

Instagram where people, they like play sections of the audiobook when

she's being like a badass and they have like hand-drawn, like crudely handdrawn comics of her

you know, like whatever she's doing like the most sort of absurd interpretation.

It's it's excellent.

Yeah, I look for it.

Did that give you enough time to think about what you would change?

Yes, yeah.

Actually, I kind of, I agree with one of Alex's earlier points.

Like this is a movie that really has heart and like it's a story that like lives and breathes on his heart

And I do think, like the whole, the tragedy

of like, Ilyuchna and the guy who

died, like the book does a really good job of establishing their

early friendship with grace, like the three astronauts who end up going together.

And so like it hits so much harder as he's like rediscovering their

lives together and like the things that they loved and like the people

they were and their hopes and dreams for this mission and

their like goals to like save the world and to like see this other solar system

And like in the movie, like, you never,

you see them as like dead bodies and as like background extras.

And that's it.

And like it, it works, I guess, but it's like not the thing I would have cut.

Like that, that connection, that relationship and like the loss, the pain of the loss from his like

only fellow humans.

He's the only human out here in this, the Tao system.

I think it would have hit harder if they had developed Ilyukna and the guy.

I can't remember his name.

Thank you.

Any projects you want to plug?

Any things you want to talk about, social media is really quick before we wrap it up?

Me?

Yes.

Yeah, you guys can follow me on blue

Sky at Jpspalding.com where I talk

about writing, writing craft, sci-fi, books, and my dog

And I just started doing things on Substack.

So we'll see if that goes anywhere.

Also at JP Spalding.

So check it out.

I just wrote a piece about Saberooth tigers on there.

I read it it.

So that's something.

It was great.

Yeah.

Jordan is is a really great writer.

And we just, he wrote a book.

I was, I helped, but Jordan wrote together.

We worked on this called 10,000 Years

at Osiris Station?

No. 10,000 years aboard.

Aboard Osiris station.

Great sci-fi, yes.

It's a sci-fi short novel and it's so good.

It's so fun.

It's retro sci-fi.

So it's like 1950s aesthetic.

Do you want to talk about that a little bit or do you want to plug anything else?

Just like very briefly, like we got to do the fun part.

We did the drafting part.

Now we get to do the hard part, which is editing.

Like, we're handing it off to first readers and people to design this thing.

And so like, you know, I would say like we're a quarter of the way through the process we've written

in into entire book, then we have to clean it up and edit it, then we have to query it and try to see if there's like a market for it.

So it was a fun process and I'm glad you were there to sort of be like the

curator and keeper of the aesthetic of the style of like a

lot of the things that I don't necessarily think about when I'm doing the writing.

So yeah, it was a fun process.

I would definitely

collaborate again and I'm looking forward to the next one.

But yeah, I don't know.

Like this was such an inspiration.

Like, Hail Mary, Project Hail Mary was no

joke, like a comp that I would cite for like

two of the of the manuscripts that I was working on because

I was like, yeah, this is it an inspiration.

Like, anything I can do that's like Project Hail Mary is a success.

So, yeah, I've I've been connected to this property for a long time.

I've taken so much inspiration from this film

And it's great stuff.

So we can we can't wait for all that to eventually

come out and people can read it and stuff.

We wrote Speaking of horror, we wrote a zombie

cruise, our horror screenplay together.

That was such a fun project, too.

Someday we'll be reviewing the film of that on this channel.

I hope so.

I hope so.

No, thanks for being on, Jordan.

Did you have a social mediaias besides, or did you have a letterterbox rating?

Sorry, that's what I meant to ask you.

Oh, do I have a letterbox rating?

Yeah, do you use Letterbox?

I'm not super familiar with Letterbox, so I'll just give it a seven out of five.

Nice.

Okay.

Thank you for that.

Lisa, any things that you would change and where can people finding?

What are you working on?

So I have to agree.

Initially I was going to say, gosh, it's going to be hard for me to find anything I

would change, but I do agree after you said that, I

would have loved to have had just a little bit more backstory about how they formed that close friendship

because clearly he had an emotional bond to them when you see

him like sending the bodies off and kind of reminiscing looking

at like the photos of, you know, their families and stuff.

But it would have been nice to have just a little bit more on that

so that you could, I mean, obviously, I felt the emotion, but I think I would have felt it more

had I had a little bit of that backstory to see them like bonding.

Even if it was flashbacks, that's fine, but a little bit more on that.

And the other thing is, I want to see, I want to see

his life on that other planet at the end.

Because he just seems so happy.

He just seemed so happy.

I was like, good for you.

I thought it was sad that they were like, you have no family.

And he's like, yeah, I have literally no family

And he has a family there.

So honestly, I'd love to see a Project Hail

Mary 2 in his life there.

Because I thought that was very sweet.

So and I think they could actually do something with that that would be a sweet movie too.

But I agree about the backstory.

The Cody sci-fi version, Hail Mary 2?

That's right.

Yes.

The feel-good version of it with maybe not

as much science except for how do they make the dome so that he survives there.

As far as projects, I just

finished with, we just had the Denver 48 Hour film fest, which

is always doing those timed fests are so much fun,

so much chaos, so little sleep.

But that will be screening this weekend in Denver at the bug theaterater

And it's over several days,

but what an intense, intense thing, our genre

was femme Fel, which was really interesting.

And the group that Wait, the femme Fale?

No, so it was interesting because this

production company that I worked with was brand new

and they do a lot around mental health.

And so they do a lot of like psychological pagth mental health things.

And they took this to, without spoiling it,

they took it to a level that was, I played a very intense scene.

It was short

but I was a parent that was very verbally

not very good to their kid.

And it was the first time that I had such an intense scene

that affected me emotionally, that I had to come home and I had to like decompress.

And then we all watched

the completed project together and I again had to decompress.

But I think it's going to be super powerful even

though the, you know, the title of it's a happy medium.

So it will be out on YouTube after it

depends when we screen it and if we win anything, then we get to go on to some

festivals.

And if not, then we'll get to put it on YouTube.

But it was it was pretty powerful, actually.

So look for that on YouTube.

It's called a Happy Medium.

I've got a trailer posted on my Instagram, which is Red Feather Girl 01.

And

that and then I'll be out, I think in your neck of the woods

out in California, I was

invited to be part of the iHeart some concert and

iHart Radio Stud in Cattle Barbara, I think.

Oh, Oh, that's where Arnold is.

Yeah.

So I don't know what this is about.

This is my first booking through the agency that I sent in Utah.

So kind of fun.

Congratulations.

I actually have a. that works first. iHeartRadio out here in San Diego.

Yeah.

Somebody named Yuli, I think she's a brand new performer, maybe.

I don't see a lot of her, but I was like.

Oh, I've heard that name before.

I've heard that name before.

It should be fun.

Yeah..

So in my first, actually my second trip ever to California.

Oh, there you go.

Yeah.

Well, thank you for that, Lisa.

And By the way, HLP says that he would have more dancing because he likes to dance choreography.

We' dancing, yeah. dance number.

It's this.

When he does that.

And then earlier, we were talking about sci-fi

and Wes Anderson darting science sci-fi.

He did mention Asteroid City, but that's not really.

I mean, that's...

It was close.

It was close.

That was close one of my favorite Wes Andersons, honestly, is Asteroid City.

I thought that was a really, really strong.

The most Wes Anderson Wes Anderson film.

Exactly.

Yeah, perhaps.

I need to watch that again.

I started watching it and I kind of fell asleep.

Jeff Goldblum part?

Like, come on.

That's, you know, I was the film.

I think I was just tired.

That's all.

Yeah.

I didn't get back to it.

I was like, uh, I need to go to bed.

I have work tomorrow.

Well, thank you guys for all that.

The only last things I have to say, you know, I loved it.

I think Ryan Gosing is, he's a charm machine.

Like the charisma that comes off this guy is so, I don't know know.

It's going to be studied one day, I think.

The next Ghostwriter.

The next Ghostwriter.

Wow, yeah.

Crazy to think that, yeah.

But there he is.

He's a good actor.

I was looking at his filmography.

I was like

he's very choosy with movies that he does because

he hasn't done as much as like a lot of his counterparts, but

all the ones he's done are like pretty much all good.

Even the Notebook, which I don't like the Notbook, but that was a huge hit.

Can't deny that.

They're all pretty iconic.

Yeah.

Oh, absolutely. made Gosling.

That's like...

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah.

Mars and the Real Girl?

Great movie.

I need to watch that again, but that was such an interesting movie.

Especially in today's world.

But we won't get into all that.

But yeah.

Ryan Kosin's great.

Everyone's great.

Phil Lord and

the director themselves, Phil Lord and Christopher Miller,

you know, they just know how to do comedy and drama so well.

So good on them.

And yeah, I gave it four and a half stars on Lbox.

You can find me on Letterbox.

Boots too Big F the show, Har.

We're else've never seen the podcast.

We're on YouTube.

We're on Blue Sky, Twitter, Threads, Facebook, TikTok, Instagram

Visit our website.

Neverseap podcastodcast.com, Email us, podcast. never seen it at gmail.com.

Leave us a like.

Leave us a comment.

What did you like about Project H Mary?

Leave us a review.

Did you read the book?

Let us know.

We'd love to read your comments on the air.

And yeah, thanks to Mr. Kyle Mason a cycle

for the intro now music you can find, Kyle, on Instagram at

selfies underscore unders underscore pets.

We didn't have Arnold tonight's no snooze meter, but thanks to Mr. HLP for the Sn music

And yeah, that's pretty much it.

Any final thoughts from anybody before we rep.

Can I sing us out?

Sure.

Go ahead.

We got to, we got to away.

Oh, we got got to, we got to away.

We got to, we got to away.

Okay, we're just under copyright strike, so that's good.

Perfect.

Okay.

Perfect.

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